Carp might be done for the year. Best OPS by a Yankees player since WWII, min. 150 PA:

Mickey Mantle 1957, 1.177
Mickey Mantle, 1956, 1.169
Matt Carpenter, 2022, 1.138
Mickey Mantle, 1961, 1.135
Mickey Mantle, 1962, 1.091

Aaron Judge this year is only at 1.068, like a chump.

I'm not sure Mickey Mantle would be putting up those kinds of numbers against 2022's pitchers. The AL of the Mick's era was about as weak as it gets, without a single inner circle HoF pitcher in his prime that he ever had to face.

I'll betcha this protects his otherworldly rate stats, and is net good for the Yankees. With no evidence at all, I have thought for a week or so that his regression would be horrid; that he was about to hit .120 for the rest of the season, with plentiful ABs.

The magic carpet ride has gotta end at some point. Ideally, it's with a big game when it really count. But frankly he carried them when they "needed" to be carried. If he does not return, his 2022 has been a roaring success.

Can't wait to see his Strat-o-Matic card.

I'm not sure Mickey Mantle would be putting up those kinds of numbers against 2022's pitchers. The AL of the Mick's era was about as weak as it gets, without a single inner circle HoF pitcher in his prime that he ever had to face.

What inner circle HOFers has Carpenter faced this year?

Can't wait to see his Strat-o-Matic card.

HOMERUN
plus injury

What inner circle HOFers has Carpenter faced this year?

Obviously he hasn't faced any current HoFers, but I'd put Verlander's, McClanahan's and Castillo's stuff over the likes of Lemon, Wynn, and Billy Pierce. The closest to the former three was probably Herb Score, who was the AL's best pitcher by quite a bit until he ran into Gil McDougald's line drive.

He hasn't faced Verlander or McClanahan. He faced Castillo for 3 PAs.

Mickey faced 12 HOF pitchers. Using the term loosely- Tommy LaSorda is in there and he’s not in the hall for his pitching.

Most PA were against Wynn, Lemon, Kaat, and Bunning. Inner circle they are not.

Mickey did all right against Feller and crushed Satchel Paige, but they certainly were well past prime when they faced Mickey.

Looking at the postseason adds a few more. He was 1 for 10 against Gibson and 1 for 7 against Koufax. In each case, the one hit was a homer.

One could argue that a lot of pitchers have HOF stuff when they are only pitching for an inning at a time, 50 times per season.

This is a silly discussion though, since I'm sure Mantle had a lot of 150-PA stretches where his OPS was better than 1.138. (For example, at the end of May 1956, or after 189 PA, he was hitting .414 with a 1.365 OPS, 20 HR and 50 RBI.) Basically, the best 154 PA of Carpenter's career were about as good as a peak Mantle full season.

I can't argue against the AL being the weaker league when Mantle played, but how many first circle HOFers would he have faced in the NL? Spahn (and Mick always did better against lefties), Gibson, maybe Roberts. By the time Koufax became KOUFAX in 1962, Mantle was on the downslope (despite his MVP in '62). Who am I missing for the meat of Mantle's career?

Alo, integration, one of the main reasons for NL superiority in the '50s and '60s, came much slower for pitchers than for position players, so would've been a lesser factor for Mantle NL vs. AL than the overall differences in league strength.

Basically, the best 154 PA of Carpenter's career were about as good as a peak Mantle full season.

This wasn’t close to the best 154 PAs of Carpenter’s career. In the same number of PAs between June 11 and July 23, 2018, he hit .352/.461/.859.

when Mantle played, but how many first circle HOFers would he have faced in the NL?

And Mantle, of course, had an OPS of .908 in 273 World Series PAs, homering against both Koufax and Gibson. Not every pitcher he faced was that level, or even HOVG, but on the whole that competition was pretty impressive.

Carpenter is expected to miss 6-8 weeks. The lockout-caused later than normal end of the regular season might help him a bit, as would the Yankees having a 1st round bye, but he’d be cutting it pretty close to be ready by the playoffs.

Of course it's not just about facing inner circle hofers, it's about facing people having elite years in those years, 1956 (1.169 ops) was Lynn's best year and Score's second best and Lemon's second/third best. (not going to go through all the years, just pointing it out) I get the argument that the pitching was inferior, although an argument could be made that if it's possible to have an extreme high era+ in a league, that means the average is probably weak.

Either way I think elite players of almost any post 1920 era would play to their competition. Definitely post integration(even if their league didn't integrate)

And Mantle, of course, had an OPS of .908 in 273 World Series PAs, homering against both Koufax and Gibson. Not every pitcher he faced was that level, or even HOVG, but on the whole that competition was pretty impressive.

Interesting that Mantle's far most significant World Series came in 1952, when he was only 20 years old. He tripled in the 8th inning of game 4 and came home on a bad throw to provide an insurance run in a 2-0 win. His 8th inning home run in game 6 proved to be the winning run in a 3-2 win. And in game 7 his 6th inning home run broke a 2-2 tie, and his 7th inning single gave the Yankees an insurance run in their 4-2 victory. He had 3 other World Series (1960, 1964 and 1956) with higher OPS numbers, but in none of them did his heroics show such a consistent pattern of game changing results.

(In 1956 his home run in game 5 was the winning run in Larsen's perfect game, but in games 6 and 7 he was limited to a garbage time double. And in 1964 his heroics went for naught, as the Cardinals won in 7 games.)

One could argue that a lot of pitchers have HOF stuff when they are only pitching for an inning at a time, 50 times per season.

And it'd be a valid argument. We can go back and forth on the relative quality of today's starters vs the AL starters of the late 50's / early 60's, but what Carpenter has had to face from the 6th inning on has been light years tougher than what Mantle was up against in the late innings during his entire career, facing the starter 4 times a game along with relief pitchers who (with some exceptions) were largely failed starters with average stuff at best. There's simply no comparison.

One could argue that a lot of pitchers have HOF stuff when they are only pitching for an inning at a time, 50 times per season.

The problem with that argument is it actually helps Jolly's claim.

And it'd be a valid argument. We can go back and forth on the relative quality of today's starters vs the AL starters of the late 50's / early 60's, but what Carpenter has had to face from the 6th inning on has been light years tougher than what Mantle was up against in the late innings during his entire career, facing the starter 4 times a game along with relief pitchers who (with some exceptions) were largely failed starters with average stuff at best. There's simply no comparison.

Hitters must have really sucked back then.

There's no reason to suppose that the level of baseball talent hasn't risen over the past 60+ years, just as it has in all other sports.** Rosters today are loaded with pitchers whose dominating speed and variety of pitches were only found in a tiny number of pitchers from that earlier era.

** And enough with the argument (not saying you're making it) about expansion diluting the talent, an argument you find among many of my overly nostalgic contemporaries. Population gains and the accumulated talent from Latin America to Japan has more than made up for the extra 14 teams.

** And enough with the argument (not saying you're making it) about expansion diluting the talent, an argument you find among many of my overly nostalgic contemporaries. Population gains and the accumulated talent from Latin America to Japan has more than made up for the extra 14 teams.

I'm merely noting that if pitchers today are so much better than the shitty ones of yore, then the hitters back then had to be equally crappy, because the R/G levels aren't significantly different.

You could argue that both players and pitchers rose or sank to the level of their competition, but definitely the average hitter of today could more easily adjust to 1950's / 60's pitching than the average hitter then could adjust to a steady diet of 100 MPH heaters and 95 MPH breaking pitches.

I'm merely noting that if pitchers today are so much better than the shitty ones of yore, then the hitters back then had to be equally crappy, because the R/G levels aren't significantly different.

I'll buy that. Just click around the br.com team pages in the early 70's and you'll see a bunch of teams where their starting C-2B-SS-CF and often the 3B and/or another outfielder combine for a total of like 20-30 HR. Sometimes even less than that.

I'll buy that. Just click around the br.com team pages in the early 70's and you'll see a bunch of teams where their starting C-2B-SS-CF and often the 3B and/or another outfielder combine for a total of like 20-30 HR. Sometimes even less than that.

Yes, they were low homer eras. But they weren't low run-scoring eras, so the runs came from somewhere.

There's no doubt that quality is going to improve over time. It's probably inevitable. But I don't believe it's anywhere near where Andy is suggesting (largely because I don't believe in the invincibility of the modern one-inning reliever. Yes, they strike out a lot of guys. But many of them still give up a lot of runs, just as they have in every era).

Hell, if baseball evolution was as quick as some seem to think, guys couldn't put together 20-year careers. But Omar Vizquel was the same hitter in 2012 as he was in 1989.

Over his last 154 plate appearances, Carpenter is not even the hottest Yankee from this year.

From 6-30 to 8-10,

Judge 154 PA, 336/461/784, 16 HR, 40 RBI.